Members Login
Username 
 
Password 
    Remember Me  
Post Info TOPIC: Keren Daniel.


Student

Status: Offline
Posts: 116
Date: Jan 6 7:45 PM, 2016
RE: Keren Daniel.
Permalink  
 


 True, but being married to Mark should not have been all that bad for her.  He truly loved her.  It was nothing, for example, like Morwenna's marriage to Ossie.

 

 

But that shouldn't justify the manner in which she was killed . . . or Ross helping her killer avoid prison.



__________________


Student

Status: Offline
Posts: 195
Date: Apr 11 6:48 PM, 2012
Permalink  
 

bronny wrote:

Yes.....and at least he was fairly easy on the eye! (if that means anything) ......unlike Ossie!


 The way Ossie was portrayed in the TV series, though, it seems like he was someone who could have been handsome, if he only lost some weight.  But he was a glutton, and was in denial about the fact that he had a weight problem, which was why the doctor told him to abstain from intercourse with Morwenna during and immediately after her pregnancy.  Ossie was too arrogant to listen to the doctor's advice if it meant making any changes in his lifestyle.



__________________


Student

Status: Offline
Posts: 195
Date: Apr 11 3:10 PM, 2012
Permalink  
 

bronny wrote:

Yes.....and at least he was fairly easy on the eye! (if that means anything) ......unlike Ossie!


 That's true!  I think a lot of other eligable young women in the villiage would have been happy to marry him!



__________________


Honorary Life Member.

Status: Offline
Posts: 508
Date: Apr 11 4:23 AM, 2012
Permalink  
 

Yes.....and at least he was fairly easy on the eye! (if that means anything) ......unlike Ossie!

__________________

Demelza

 

A passionate child rolling in the dust with her ugly dog; a girl driving oxen; a woman....Did anything else matter?



Student

Status: Offline
Posts: 195
Date: Apr 11 2:49 AM, 2012
Permalink  
 

bronny wrote:
Sabrina wrote:

 I also saw the foreshaddowing that their marriage was not going to work out.  They were not right for each other, no matter how much Mark may have idealised her. 


I guess I feel sorry for her because she was in one sense a victim of the age she was living in - how many women in the 18th century ended up in bad marriages because they simply had to find a way of surviving? Her marrying Mark was a means of having a roof over her head, meagre as it was, and getting away from her acting life. She was never going to be satisfied though.   


 True, but being married to Mark should not have been all that bad for her.  He truly loved her.  It was nothing, for example, like Morwenna's marriage to Ossie.



__________________


Honorary Life Member.

Status: Offline
Posts: 508
Date: Apr 11 12:32 AM, 2012
Permalink  
 

Sabrina wrote:

 I also saw the foreshaddowing that their marriage was not going to work out.  They were not right for each other, no matter how much Mark may have idealised her. 


I guess I feel sorry for her because she was in one sense a victim of the age she was living in - how many women in the 18th century ended up in bad marriages because they simply had to find a way of surviving? Her marrying Mark was a means of having a roof over her head, meagre as it was, and getting away from her acting life. She was never going to be satisfied though.   



__________________

Demelza

 

A passionate child rolling in the dust with her ugly dog; a girl driving oxen; a woman....Did anything else matter?



Honorary Life Member.

Status: Offline
Posts: 508
Date: Apr 11 12:28 AM, 2012
Permalink  
 

Mrs Gimlett wrote:

Not sure why you feel sorry for Keren.  I reckon she was a scheming little minx.  Bronny, when you have read your first edition 'Demelza', you might agree.  There is much more about her and Mark in this book and it is not at all pretty. 

 


 Oh thanks Jane I shall look forward to it very much!



__________________

Demelza

 

A passionate child rolling in the dust with her ugly dog; a girl driving oxen; a woman....Did anything else matter?



Student

Status: Offline
Posts: 195
Date: Apr 10 10:16 PM, 2012
Permalink  
 

Mrs Gimlett wrote:

Not sure why you feel sorry for Keren.  I reckon she was a scheming little minx.  Bronny, when you have read your first edition 'Demelza', you might agree.  There is much more about her and Mark in this book and it is not at all pretty.  Mark was so much overawed by her fragility and the fact that she was very different from anything he had known before, you could see their marriage was going to be a disaster.  She was much the quicker brained, able to think ahead whereas poor old Mark was steady, reliable and unable to work out that she really was not for him. 

I was always struck by Ross' assessment of Mark when he went to the Scillies to meet him and found a shell of a man, haunted by his actions. Ross suddenly wondered if he was as untouched by time as he had supposed.


 I also saw the foreshaddowing that their marriage was not going to work out.  They were not right for each other, no matter how much Mark may have idealised her.  Dwight would not have been any better for her, because he could not give her the life of excitement she wanted or further her acting career.  It wasn't surprising that Mark was forever haunted by the event, he of course felt remorse for killing her, and was also unable to have a relationship with a woman ever again.



__________________


Honorary Life Member. Forum Moderator

Status: Offline
Posts: 653
Date: Apr 10 9:36 PM, 2012
Permalink  
 

Not sure why you feel sorry for Keren.  I reckon she was a scheming little minx.  Bronny, when you have read your first edition 'Demelza', you might agree.  There is much more about her and Mark in this book and it is not at all pretty.  Mark was so much overawed by her fragility and the fact that she was very different from anything he had known before, you could see their marriage was going to be a disaster.  She was much the quicker brained, able to think ahead whereas poor old Mark was steady, reliable and unable to work out that she really was not for him. 

I was always struck by Ross' assessment of Mark when he went to the Scillies to meet him and found a shell of a man, haunted by his actions. Ross suddenly wondered if he was as untouched by time as he had supposed.



__________________


Student

Status: Offline
Posts: 195
Date: Apr 10 3:04 PM, 2012
Permalink  
 

bronny wrote:

By the way, I always liked her full name 'Kerenhappech' (sp?) - very pretty.


 Keren-happuch

Keren-happuch, sometimes spelled Kerenhappuch[14] ("horn of the face-paint" or "cosmetic-box"), is the name of Job's third daughter (Job 42:14), who was born after prosperity had returned to him.[15]



__________________


Student

Status: Offline
Posts: 195
Date: Apr 10 2:26 AM, 2012
Permalink  
 

bronny wrote:

By the way, I always liked her full name 'Kerenhappech' (sp?) - very pretty.


 Thanks!  I did remember that it was something unusual!



__________________


Student

Status: Offline
Posts: 195
Date: Apr 6 4:43 PM, 2012
Permalink  
 

bronny wrote:

I feel sorry for her too....if only she'd hooked up with Dwight earlier instead of Mark.....but would that have happened? Socially it probably wouldn't have been appropriate for Dwight....but I still reckon she would have become bored being a doctor's wife. Poor Keren was never going to be satisfied.


 I believe that's true.  She would have become bored as a doctor's wife and would still have looked for greener pastures elsewhere



__________________


Honorary Life Member.

Status: Offline
Posts: 508
Date: Apr 6 12:00 AM, 2012
Permalink  
 

By the way, I always liked her full name 'Kerenhappech' (sp?) - very pretty.

__________________

Demelza

 

A passionate child rolling in the dust with her ugly dog; a girl driving oxen; a woman....Did anything else matter?



Honorary Life Member.

Status: Offline
Posts: 508
Date: Apr 5 11:59 PM, 2012
Permalink  
 

I feel sorry for her too....if only she'd hooked up with Dwight earlier instead of Mark.....but would that have happened? Socially it probably wouldn't have been appropriate for Dwight....but I still reckon she would have become bored being a doctor's wife. Poor Keren was never going to be satisfied.

__________________

Demelza

 

A passionate child rolling in the dust with her ugly dog; a girl driving oxen; a woman....Did anything else matter?



Student

Status: Offline
Posts: 195
Date: Apr 5 7:38 PM, 2012
Permalink  
 

Smollett wrote:

I have a wee bit of sympathy for Keren; yeah I know, ashamed  she was a  self centred manipulative cow & caused so much unhappiness, but she was trying to survive in a harsh world & using her assets to 'get ahead'. Her relationship with her former boss is evidence of this.

She was jealous of Demelza, yes, and bitter. I suspect I would be a bit bitter too in her shoes... Good looking, young,  talented, & clever, but not clever enough -she misjudged her control over men and this was her undoing. Women at court behaved this way, unscrupulously; Keren was not in their league, and this was a Cornish mining village, so her fantasies couldn't be realised. She died unmourned, and I feel a wee bit of pity for her.


 I guess I feel a wee bit of pity for her too.  But I just don't like it when people manipulate other people to get what they want.  I see what you mean about the double standard with regard to class status though, and her disapointment that her fantasies couldn't be realized.



__________________


Honorary Life Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 298
Date: Apr 5 7:32 AM, 2012
Permalink  
 

I have a wee bit of sympathy for Keren; yeah I know, ashamed  she was a  self centred manipulative cow & caused so much unhappiness, but she was trying to survive in a harsh world & using her assets to 'get ahead'. Her relationship with her former boss is evidence of this.

She was jealous of Demelza, yes, and bitter. I suspect I would be a bit bitter too in her shoes... Good looking, young,  talented, & clever, but not clever enough -she misjudged her control over men and this was her undoing. Women at court behaved this way, unscrupulously; Keren was not in their league, and this was a Cornish mining village, so her fantasies couldn't be realised. She died unmourned, and I feel a wee bit of pity for her.



__________________
SMOLLETT


Student

Status: Offline
Posts: 195
Date: Mar 29 5:02 PM, 2012
Permalink  
 

bronny wrote:
Sabrina wrote:

 I agree, it is easy to have a lot of sympathy for Mark.  He put Keren on a pedastal when he first met her without getting to know the kind of person she really was.


 Yes and you can see why - she would have appeared so interesting and 'exotic' to him - an actress wow! Compared to all the local girls....and similarly she would have missed all that attention after she married him. So you can kind of see her point of view too. Bad decision on both their parts.....and Dwight's too. He was luckily to have got out of that relatively easily and to have retained the trust of the locals.


 True, I guess she would have missed her acting career and all of the attention after she married Mark.  But then, what did she expect?  Dwight seemed lonely for female companionship at that time, although I'm not exactly sure why, I would have thought he would have had a lot of pretty women to choose from.  Thank God he finally met Caroline.  As for Mark, he had to flee the country, and I think later died without ever having re-married, very sad.



__________________


Honorary Life Member.

Status: Offline
Posts: 508
Date: Mar 17 11:01 PM, 2012
Permalink  
 

Sabrina wrote:

 I agree, it is easy to have a lot of sympathy for Mark.  He put Keren on a pedastal when he first met her without getting to know the kind of person she really was.


 Yes and you can see why - she would have appeared so interesting and 'exotic' to him - an actress wow! Compared to all the local girls....and similarly she would have missed all that attention after she married him. So you can kind of see her point of view too. Bad decision on both their parts.....and Dwight's too. He was luckily to have got out of that relatively easily and to have retained the trust of the locals.



__________________

Demelza

 

A passionate child rolling in the dust with her ugly dog; a girl driving oxen; a woman....Did anything else matter?



Student

Status: Offline
Posts: 195
Date: Mar 17 3:08 PM, 2012
Permalink  
 

Char Nanfan wrote:

I think the main difference between Demelza and Keren was Demelza never expected more than she was given and so she  appreciated the different lifestyle she so unexpectedly was offered even as a  servant to Ross whereas keren thought the world owed her big time! 

Its strange that in the case of Keren Daniel , i believe most readers and viewers hold most sympathy for Mark, he never really knew what hit him! and his life was ruined thereafter.


 I agree, it is easy to have a lot of sympathy for Mark.  He put Keren on a pedastal when he first met her without getting to know the kind of person she really was.



__________________


Graduate

Status: Offline
Posts: 997
Date: Mar 16 8:38 AM, 2012
Permalink  
 

I think the main difference between Demelza and Keren was Demelza never expected more than she was given and so she  appreciated the different lifestyle she so unexpectedly was offered even as a  servant to Ross whereas keren thought the world owed her big time! 

Its strange that in the case of Keren Daniel , i believe most readers and viewers hold most sympathy for Mark, he never really knew what hit him! and his life was ruined thereafter.



__________________


Student

Status: Offline
Posts: 195
Date: Mar 15 9:20 PM, 2012
Permalink  
 

Char Nanfan wrote:

She was not a sympathetic character yet had a similar background to demelza so why she was quite so ambitious and soulless, was never really explained. She was unable to relate to anyone really, and would probably have met a sticky end at some point as she seemed unable to understand other peoples emotions or characters.


 I believe you are right.  She thought the whole world revolved around her and her desires.



__________________


Graduate

Status: Offline
Posts: 724
Date: Mar 15 8:46 PM, 2012
Permalink  
 

Karen Daniel was jealous of our Demelza, therefore, I didn't like her disbelief.gif

Bella



__________________

 



Graduate

Status: Offline
Posts: 997
Date: Mar 15 8:27 PM, 2012
Permalink  
 

She was not a sympathetic character yet had a similar background to demelza so why she was quite so ambitious and soulless, was never really explained. She was unable to relate to anyone really, and would probably have met a sticky end at some point as she seemed unable to understand other peoples emotions or characters.



__________________


Student

Status: Offline
Posts: 236
Date: Mar 15 5:00 PM, 2012
Permalink  
 

The whole district did not judge Dwight harshly after her murder, because of her revealed character. Lonely young doctor....



__________________


Student

Status: Offline
Posts: 195
Date: Mar 14 3:38 PM, 2012
Permalink  
 

Brigantia wrote:

Oh, Keren! How I longed to give her a slap! I was willing Mark not to marry her all along (see how I treat these wonderful characters like real people??)


 I know, I definiitely would have advised him not to marry her!



__________________


Student

Status: Offline
Posts: 186
Date: Mar 14 3:31 PM, 2012
Permalink  
 

Oh, Keren! How I longed to give her a slap! I was willing Mark not to marry her all along (see how I treat these wonderful characters like real people??)

__________________
One false move and Phit! ye're dead . . .


Student

Status: Offline
Posts: 195
Date: Mar 13 7:33 PM, 2012
Permalink  
 

I did not like this character.  She was a manipulator who used both her husband Mark and Dr. Enys.  It was tragic the way she died, but it was no wonder that few people had much sympathy for her.



__________________


Administration

Status: Offline
Posts: 1565
Date: May 1 2:45 PM, 2011
Permalink  
 

Keren Daniel



__________________

"Perfection is a full stop .... Ever the climbing but never the attaining Of the mountain top." W.G.

 

 

Page 1 of 1  sorted by
 
Quick Reply

Please log in to post quick replies.